Emperor L
[ Posts : 1237 ]
 | [Post Date: 05-Aug-2008 00:00]
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You need 1 freighter per food per turn.
Basicaly each unit of food you need to transport takes 1 freighter, and this is needed every turn to keep supplying food to the planet.
You also need to have excess food production on some of your other planets, enough to cover whats needed on others.
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Farmers or food production, cause all of my worlds have food production without farmers.
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Just food, as long as your making it, it dont matter if its done by farmers or not.
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Maverick
[ Posts : 1331 ]
 | [Post Date: 05-Aug-2008 10:05]
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Im not sure what the difference between either way is, but i like the "from star map only" part.
So you can activate a fleet and bomb a planet the same way you would colonize one?
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Yes, its like colonizing a planet from star map only. The main problem is that battle, bombardment, planet invasion and planet colonization must take some turns. Currently you have an instant colonization, but it should take at least 1 turn. So colonization actually is a fleet "mission". Because you cannot colonize it several time you cannot abuse it. When bombarding though, if it is implemented that way, you'll be able to bombard several times in a turn and this is not correct as a bombardment must continue several turns same as space battle do.
Thinking a little bit more I'm inclined to make "path/mission" manager before activating bombardment.
Meanwhile you could think on how strong planetary defenses should be. Take in consideration following information:
These buildings participate in bombardment phase only:
- Missile Base: Fires missiles (same as torpedoes) Will file Ts number of best short ranged torpedoes, Tm number of best mid ranged torpedoes and Tl number of best long range torpedoes.
- Fighter Garrison: Have best maneuverability. Can be considered as half of a corvette. Fights only in close combat. I.E. have 1 best close combat beam installed. Fn number of this fighters will attack. Have no shields.
- Ground Batteries: Same idea as missile base but fires from beam weapons.
- Stellar Converter: 1 very big cannon. Fires only as long range. Hits first the biggest ships such as titans then smaller ones. Should be able to destroy at least one titan per turn imho.
- Defense Network: When a fleet is attacking a planet it passes through a defense system (mines and other stuff). It will inflict some damage to ships in fleet, depending on some random values and ship maneuverability.
- Space Base / Battle Station / Star Fortress: This should be a blend between Missile Base and Ground batteries.
As you see orbital battle are more complicated then it was in DQ:E. I hope it will be more fun this way.
All buildings should have shield capacity and structure points.
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Disrupter
[ Posts : 458 ]
 | [Post Date: 05-Aug-2008 15:06]
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- Fighter Garrison: Have best maneuverability. Can be considered as half of a corvette. Fights only in close combat. I.E. have 1 best close combat beam installed. Fn number of this fighters will attack. Have no shields.
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I think that starfighters should not actually be destroyed unless you have corvettes with you. If you think about how big a fighter is relative to capital ships, even when a titan fires everything it has in one direction, the fighters can still out-maneuver it. I think that corvettes should be needed to either neutralize or combat fighters since they are really small.
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- Space Base / Battle Station / Star Fortress: This should be a blend between Missile Base and Ground batteries.
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My feeling on these three is that a Space Base has the fire power of up to 10 combined missile and beam batteries. The Battle Station should have maybe 30 combined missile and beam batteries. For the Star fortress, i know its not what youve been going for, but i keep thinking of it as a system wide defensive structure that hits ships anywhere in the system. Just because of its name really. It should be worse then a Titan though, maybe 50-60 missile and beam batteries.
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Emperor L
[ Posts : 1237 ]
| [Post Date: 05-Aug-2008 16:40]
I was thinking of a space base and its later advancements like orbital bases from DQ:E, so huge attack and defence.Didnt think of using ships weapons, but that could be good. Maybe we could customise them like ships?
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- Defense Network: When a fleet is attacking a planet it passes through a defense system (mines and other stuff). It will inflict some damage to ships in fleet, depending on some random values and ship maneuverability.
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By mines do you like exploding mines? Not mines like where you get metals 
Anyway, thats not really a network is it? More like a bunch of single mines scattered about. I was thinking a defence network should like join all other defences and increase accuracy of all other defence buildings, by linking them all up. Maybe give a 25% accuracy increase? Like battle computers?
Also, do orbital buildings get destroyed first? In this case maybe have 2 levels of attack, orbital and ground like in DQ:E
Then you must beat all orbital buildings before the ground attack.
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Thinking a little bit more I'm inclined to make "path/mission" manager before activating bombardment.
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Well, for now if we can bombard many times each turn, its easier for testing. We can see a whole battle happen in 1 turn, and test as and when we need. For real game though it will need changing...
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Meanwhile you could think on how strong planetary defenses should be. Take in consideration following information:
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Well, for this we need to know roughly how big fleets will be, and how many planets players will have...
Now, I dont think just the number of players will be enough to limit players expansion, and all will happen is the player who spend most time playing will win, and turn based games really should minimise this as much as possible. Checking back 2-3 times per day for maybe 15 mins at a time should be really the maximum needed to build...
This round I spen hours trying to bioform all my planets, and if I spent twice that time, I could have 200 planets, if I spent all day everyday I could take every planet in the galaxy.
I dont like colonisation limits, but I think its needed. Why build a fleet and invade a planet, when I can colonise 1 for almost nothing? When the galaxy is full it will be ok, but even then, if its full no new players can join.
Now, I think 30 planets is about the maximum we need. You said 10-20 planets on average, so probably players should have 15 on average? This makes the max twice the average, so thats a good amount 
Anyway, once we know the size of empires, its easier to know the maximum ships a player can have, and how strong planets defences can be.
Anyway, I think invasion and bombardment were too easy in DQ:E. I always build fleets of 5 million transports and 20+ million troops. I lost maybe a few thousand ships per planet I invaded, and with 2 or 3 fleets that size and 100000 capital ships, nothing could stop you. I could take like 100 well defended planets with each fleet. I never had that many enemys planets to attack, but if they existed I could have taken them...
That said, it shouldnt be too hard either...also, titans are not really a good way to describe the damage I dont think. They have much lower defence than the same ammount of money spent on other ships. Think 3 frigates have the same defence as a titan. Where I could built tons for 12000+ spent.
But I think maybe titans would have higher attack, so weapons that destroy the big ships first (like stellar converter) would help alot I think, but will not be much use against a fleet of small ships...
This message was edited by Emperor L
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Maverick
[ Posts : 1331 ]
| [Post Date: 05-Aug-2008 18:04]
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I was thinking of a space base and its later advancements like orbital bases from DQ:E, so huge attack and defence.Didnt think of using ships weapons, but that could be good. Maybe we could customise them like ships?
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Yes, big attacks huge defense. No customization, sorry At least not now.
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- Defense Network: When a fleet is attacking a planet it passes through a defense system (mines and other stuff). It will inflict some damage to ships in fleet, depending on some random values and ship maneuverability.
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By mines do you like exploding mines? Not mines like where you get metals
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Yes, like exploding mines.
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Anyway, thats not really a network is it? More like a bunch of single mines scattered about. I was thinking a defence network should like join all other defences and increase accuracy of all other defence buildings, by linking them all up. Maybe give a 25% accuracy increase? Like battle computers?
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Great idea
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Also, do orbital buildings get destroyed first? In this case maybe have 2 levels of attack, orbital and ground like in DQ:E
Then you must beat all orbital buildings before the ground attack.
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All military buildings (orbital or ground) except marine/armored barracs participate in orbital battle. Until all buildings or entire fleet is destroyed the battle is considered in progress.
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Thinking a little bit more I'm inclined to make "path/mission" manager before activating bombardment.
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Well, for now if we can bombard many times each turn, its easier for testing. We can see a whole battle happen in 1 turn, and test as and when we need. For real game though it will need changing...
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Without any stats for military building I cannot implement bombardment. I think that i a day or two path management will be ready.
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Meanwhile you could think on how strong planetary defenses should be. Take in consideration following information:
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Well, for this we need to know roughly how big fleets will be, and how many planets players will have...
Now, I dont think just the number of players will be enough to limit players expansion, and all will happen is the player who spend most time playing will win, and turn based games really should minimise this as much as possible. Checking back 2-3 times per day for maybe 15 mins at a time should be really the maximum needed to build...
This round I spen hours trying to bioform all my planets, and if I spent twice that time, I could have 200 planets, if I spent all day everyday I could take every planet in the galaxy.
I dont like colonisation limits, but I think its needed. Why build a fleet and invade a planet, when I can colonise 1 for almost nothing? When the galaxy is full it will be ok, but even then, if its full no new players can join.
Now, I think 30 planets is about the maximum we need. You said 10-20 planets on average, so probably players should have 15 on average? This makes the max twice the average, so thats a good amount
Anyway, once we know the size of empires, its easier to know the maximum ships a player can have, and how strong planets defences can be.
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I really dont want to add any restrictions for colonization. I'll leave this for a later as possible time. I better prefer to change galaxy generation, thus good planets would be main and important points of interest.
I've implemented some changes already. See "TO DO" thread
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Anyway, I think invasion and bombardment were too easy in DQ:E. I always build fleets of 5 million transports and 20+ million troops. I lost maybe a few thousand ships per planet I invaded, and with 2 or 3 fleets that size and 100000 capital ships, nothing could stop you. I could take like 100 well defended planets with each fleet. I never had that many enemys planets to attack, but if they existed I could have taken them...
That said, it shouldnt be too hard either...also, titans are not really a good way to describe the damage I dont think. They have much lower defence than the same ammount of money spent on other ships. Think 3 frigates have the same defence as a titan. Where I could built tons for 12000+ spent.
But I think maybe titans would have higher attack, so weapons that destroy the big ships first (like stellar converter) would help alot I think, but will not be much use against a fleet of small ships...
This message was edited by Emperor L
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Titans maybe are not an etalon, but still are strongest one. Think about them as attacking unit when frigates used as a shield for them. Strong frigates will never have enough fire power to destroy a star fortress, at least they shouldn't (in normal limits of course). On another side think about military buildings as stationary ships with a lot of beams/torpedoes more than any ship could carry.
So, to start with something lets take my empire and see what I can produce and maintain and start with this numbers. Then will see
This message was edited by Maverick
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Emperor L
[ Posts : 1237 ]
| [Post Date: 05-Aug-2008 18:55]
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Titans maybe are not an etalon, but still are strongest one. Think about them as attacking unit when frigates used as a shield for them. Strong frigates will never have enough fire power to destroy a star fortress, at least they shouldn't (in normal limits of course).
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To have as much fire power as a titan (using death spores) on frigates would take 33 frigates.
Each frigate costs 255 to buy, where a titan 13765.
13765/255 = 53 meaning a titan costs as much as 53 frigates, where 33 would be equal in power...
So, I could build that much power for less on frigates, but also have MUCH more HP also, so frigates work out cheaper still per damage and HP you gain...
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So, to start with something lets take my empire and see what I can produce and maintain and start with this numbers. Then will see.
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Ok, that will help us know the sort of fleets that will be attacking and then know how much defence is needed
This message was edited by Emperor L
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Disrupter
[ Posts : 458 ]
| [Post Date: 06-Aug-2008 15:48]
Ok K, for the ranged battles, my 3 fleets, Long, Medium, and Short, are jumping to Oikkh as a staging area. Pick 3 stars nearby, and we can test this out
Edit: Ok i sent my three fleets out to the planets you mentioned in the suggestion thread. Should be there pretty quickly. Im using Swarm and of course the necessary ranges and things.
Edit 2: Ok so far, close fleets, if equipped properly seem to have fair the best. My close specialized fleets are doing the best while my far ones are doing worst right now. I think theyre all still losing to K, so we'll see.
This message was edited by Disrupter
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Disrupter
[ Posts : 458 ]
| [Post Date: 07-Aug-2008 17:03]
By the way, K, can you check our forums?
I sent you a message that i would like answered asap. Im planning to buy Torque this week, i just wanna make sure i get the right one lol.
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Maverick
[ Posts : 1331 ]
| [Post Date: 07-Aug-2008 17:13]
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So, to start with something lets take my empire and see what I can produce and maintain and start with this numbers. Then will see.
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Ok, that will help us know the sort of fleets that will be attacking and then know how much defence is needed
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OK. Here is my fleet. Now I have negative balance so it is a little bit bigger. I have 7 planets.
46 - Corvette
30 - Frigate
33 - Destroyer
23 - A T Cruiser
20 - A T Battleship
19 - A T Titan
Fleet strength is 74.3 K
Now lets think on how hard bombarding a planet should be. Personally I think that a quarter of this fleet should be able to break through orbital and ground defenses and win with very few ships left.
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Disrupter
[ Posts : 458 ]
| [Post Date: 07-Aug-2008 17:57]
I have 5 fleet groups of the following ships :
6 Subspace titans
9 Avarice Mk II (Battleships)
25 Reaper Cruisers
9 Decadence Mk II (battleships)
25 Slayer Mk II (cruisers)
Combined might per fleet group: 55.3k
Now these groups arent made for bombing, but i took your advice on small fleets. These arent too small, the 5 were all one fleet before. I tend to think that it should take a fleet of 75k or more to break through just the space defenses. I dont know how you measure bombing capacity, or how it even works, but it should take many, MANY bombs to completely raze a planet.
I dont know how you plan to have it Maverick, but i tend to think that space fleets unequipped with bombs can only clear out orbital defenses. If they have bombs or bombers with them, then they can hit planetary things like the Stellar Converter or Missile Batteries.
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Maverick
[ Posts : 1331 ]
| [Post Date: 08-Aug-2008 14:24]
Do you have any fleet ready for a test battle? If yes, please pot here its location, strength and composition so I could send a similar fleet. I need some battle stats from new weapon values.
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Disrupter
[ Posts : 458 ]
| [Post Date: 08-Aug-2008 15:00]
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Do you have any fleet ready for a test battle? If yes, please pot here its location, strength and composition so I could send a similar fleet. I need some battle stats from new weapon values.
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Well if you read the above post, i have 5 fleets set up that way, and 2 pools of ships, 1 of cruisers, the other of titans.
Pick some stars convenient for you, and ill fly my 5 fleets there.
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Maverick
[ Posts : 1331 ]
| [Post Date: 08-Aug-2008 15:25]
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Do you have any fleet ready for a test battle? If yes, please pot here its location, strength and composition so I could send a similar fleet. I need some battle stats from new weapon values.
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Well if you read the above post, i have 5 fleets set up that way, and 2 pools of ships, 1 of cruisers, the other of titans.
Pick some stars convenient for you, and ill fly my 5 fleets there.
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Send them to Ce-Ra system. It is near your Kefru-Mejez system. Total fleets strength should be about 75K.
This message was edited by Maverick
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Disrupter
[ Posts : 458 ]
| [Post Date: 08-Aug-2008 15:46]
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Pick some stars convenient for you, and ill fly my 5 fleets there.
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Send them to Ce-Ra system. It is near your Kefru-Mejez system. Total fleets strength should be about 75K.
This message was edited by Maverick[/q]
Do you want me to send all 5 fleets or 55k damage worth (each of the 5 is 55k together its 275k)?
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Maverick
[ Posts : 1331 ]
| [Post Date: 08-Aug-2008 15:51]
dup.
This message was edited by Maverick
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